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Post by Figgles on Feb 18, 2021 22:22:03 GMT
All "reality creation" techniques are mind games. Compelling as hell from the vantage point of a separate me, but from beyond, they get seen for what they are.
So then, you do seem to be saying you have never had an experience where you were completely confident, waiting in positive expectation regarding a manifestation that you knew to be coming and were surprised as it did not manifest..? Or you've never had difficulty believing something would come to pass, but then it did?
Yes, it will be like that until you learn a proper technique. Once you learnt the proper technique, then it wouldn't fail. Once you directly the way it unfolds, then it becomes strong belief. The problem here is, as you say one is not causing another to manifest but one follows another, we are exploring what follows what. Simple affirmation wouldn't work mostly, but affirmation has to be done with proper breath. Simple Visualization wouldn't work, but feeling as if it's real would work. So we are just finding what follows what. Remember all these reality creation technique highly disturbs our proper roller coaster, it goes too high and low when we use it, so reality should not be created but has to be allowed as it is. But learning the reality creation technique will teach you what follows what.The idea that you can know for absolute certain what will follow what in terms of the unfolding story, is a delusion. |
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Post by Figgles on Feb 18, 2021 22:26:54 GMT
Swear away!  But yes,the idea of having personal power to manipulate my experience if I just follow a few simple rules is enticing enough to a seeker who still suffers, that he will often search quite desperately for explanations as to why there may be apparent exceptions to the law/rule. It's not personal power which is manipulating the experience, it's God himself who is manipulating the experience. He doesn't know the truth that he is already creating the reality so he morphed himself as a person and start creating the reality differently. Nothing is actually being 'manipulated,' let alone by 'God.' God is a pointer only, not a something to which properties, qualities and actions can be directly ascribed as you are doing.
The bolded is just another 'in the dream theory/story/idea' that you seem to be trying to assert as Truth.
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Post by Figgles on Feb 18, 2021 22:43:30 GMT
What I meant by, 'the manifestation has already happened‘, I think you addressed. I feel like the future, past and present is happening, has happened. For example, I’ve had experiences of my future self bringing something into this timeline. Of course, it could be complete imagination. If that is your experience, it's your experience. As an experience, so long as it's not being mistaken for something more, something indicative of Truth beyond, there's no need to doubt it as 'an experience had.' But it is important to see that 'the future' per se, itself, is never actually experienced as all experience is here & now or not at all. Same with past. Similarly, I regularly experience continued relationship, exchanges with deceased loved ones. Many would likely say I am imagining it because it's outside of consensus trance experience. These experiences are as meaningful and compelling to me as those I had with these folks when they were alive and sitting next to me. So, while I'd balk at the suggestion I was merely 'imagining them,' I would have to concede that as experience, we are talking 'appearance only,' and not in any way indicative of Truth. (That which is known for absolute certain). Just because this current disappointment reminds you of one past, does not mean the past disappointment 'caused' this manifest outcome. (& Sorry if I am mangling what you said there). And, what feels disappointing now might turn out to be a blessing in disguise. I'm sitting smack-dab myself in circumstances surrounding my kids that had this circumstance appeared a few months ago, would have looked like a shit-pile, but at present, I am regarding, as the most perfect of circumstance. Yup! Nothing wrong with play.  I would say 'disappointment' can and does still arise, but that does not = suffering. When/if disappointment does arise, absent an SVP, it does so and then just flows on....no stickiness. |
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Post by Figgles on Feb 18, 2021 22:53:37 GMT
What I meant by, 'the manifestation has already happened‘, I think you addressed. I feel like the future, past and present is happening, has happened. For example, I’ve had experiences of my future self bringing something into this timeline. Of course, it could be complete imagination. I have an example of trying to manifest an outcome for my daughter just this week. She went up for a position in school that she really wanted but it didn’t work out. I realise that it came out of my lack, when I was in school someone pipped me at the post and I had some huge self-worth issues, so I have sat with that and allowed it to come up and accepting what is instead of being disappointed. All this feels real but at the same time like ‘noise. Yet it’s kinda fun, working it out, playing with reality etc.. I guess as long as you realise the truth then there’s no disappointment, suffering... Mmmmm She meant to say that your intention to manifest something is also a manifestation. She is absolutely correct there. You are creating your intention too.Yes, that was a point i was making. We differ though of course, in that you say the bolded, whereas I say, there no actual someone who is creating/manifesting the intention. |
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Post by Esponja on Feb 19, 2021 0:23:58 GMT
What I meant by, 'the manifestation has already happened‘, I think you addressed. I feel like the future, past and present is happening, has happened. For example, I’ve had experiences of my future self bringing something into this timeline. Of course, it could be complete imagination. If that is your experience, it's your experience. As an experience, so long as it's not being mistaken for something more, something indicative of Truth beyond, there's no need to doubt it as 'an experience had.' But it is important to see that 'the future' per se, itself, is never actually experienced as all experience is here & now or not at all. Same with past. Similarly, I regularly experience continued relationship, exchanges with deceased loved ones. Many would likely say I am imagining it because it's outside of consensus trance experience. These experiences are as meaningful and compelling to me as those I had with these folks when they were alive and sitting next to me. So, while I'd balk at the suggestion I was merely 'imagining them,' I would have to concede that as experience, we are talking 'appearance only,' and not in any way indicative of Truth. (That which is known for absolute certain). Just because this current disappointment reminds you of one past, does not mean the past disappointment 'caused' this manifest outcome. (& Sorry if I am mangling what you said there). And, what feels disappointing now might turn out to be a blessing in disguise. I'm sitting smack-dab myself in circumstances surrounding my kids that had this circumstance appeared a few months ago, would have looked like a shit-pile, but at present, I am regarding, as the most perfect of circumstance. Yup! Nothing wrong with play. I would say 'disappointment' can and does still arise, but that does not = suffering. When/if disappointment does arise, absent an SVP, it does so and then just flows on....no stickiness. Mmm so do you believe that we are here to learn lessons. I feel like once I heal parts of me that were hurt or do away with old subconscious beliefs the external changes. The lessons change. This is so hard to get my head around. I ‘get’ why it’s beyond mind. I can observe a finger pressing letters on this screen right now... I can see beyond time and the I/mind which is nothing but a stream of continuous thoughts. It’s as though you live within and with-out mind... |
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Post by Gopal on Feb 19, 2021 0:40:05 GMT
Yes, it will be like that until you learn a proper technique. Once you learnt the proper technique, then it wouldn't fail. Once you directly the way it unfolds, then it becomes strong belief. The problem here is, as you say one is not causing another to manifest but one follows another, we are exploring what follows what. Simple affirmation wouldn't work mostly, but affirmation has to be done with proper breath. Simple Visualization wouldn't work, but feeling as if it's real would work. So we are just finding what follows what. Remember all these reality creation technique highly disturbs our proper roller coaster, it goes too high and low when we use it, so reality should not be created but has to be allowed as it is. But learning the reality creation technique will teach you what follows what.The idea that you can know for absolute certain what will follow what in terms of the unfolding story, is a delusion. There kinds of problem will come when you don't have the reference to what I am talking. Look like you have never used any reality creation technique so I don't wonder. |
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Post by Gopal on Feb 19, 2021 0:41:10 GMT
It's not personal power which is manipulating the experience, it's God himself who is manipulating the experience. He doesn't know the truth that he is already creating the reality so he morphed himself as a person and start creating the reality differently. Nothing is actually being 'manipulated,' let alone by 'God.' God is a pointer only, not a something to which properties, qualities and actions can be directly ascribed as you are doing.
The bolded is just another 'in the dream theory/story/idea' that you seem to be trying to assert as Truth.
I write what I see! When there is a clarity, dream is re-orchestrated. |
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Post by Gopal on Feb 19, 2021 0:43:53 GMT
She meant to say that your intention to manifest something is also a manifestation. She is absolutely correct there. You are creating your intention too.Yes, that was a point i was making. We differ though of course, in that you say the bolded, whereas I say, there no actual someone who is creating/manifesting the intention.  |
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Post by Gopal on Feb 19, 2021 0:44:51 GMT
If that is your experience, it's your experience. As an experience, so long as it's not being mistaken for something more, something indicative of Truth beyond, there's no need to doubt it as 'an experience had.' But it is important to see that 'the future' per se, itself, is never actually experienced as all experience is here & now or not at all. Same with past. Similarly, I regularly experience continued relationship, exchanges with deceased loved ones. Many would likely say I am imagining it because it's outside of consensus trance experience. These experiences are as meaningful and compelling to me as those I had with these folks when they were alive and sitting next to me. So, while I'd balk at the suggestion I was merely 'imagining them,' I would have to concede that as experience, we are talking 'appearance only,' and not in any way indicative of Truth. (That which is known for absolute certain). Just because this current disappointment reminds you of one past, does not mean the past disappointment 'caused' this manifest outcome. (& Sorry if I am mangling what you said there). And, what feels disappointing now might turn out to be a blessing in disguise. I'm sitting smack-dab myself in circumstances surrounding my kids that had this circumstance appeared a few months ago, would have looked like a shit-pile, but at present, I am regarding, as the most perfect of circumstance. Yup! Nothing wrong with play. I would say 'disappointment' can and does still arise, but that does not = suffering. When/if disappointment does arise, absent an SVP, it does so and then just flows on....no stickiness.
Mmm so do you believe that we are here to learn lessons . I feel like once I heal parts of me that were hurt or do away with old subconscious beliefs the external changes. The lessons change.This is so hard to get my head around. I ‘get’ why it’s beyond mind. I can observe a finger pressing letters on this screen right now... I can see beyond time and the I/mind which is nothing but a stream of continuous thoughts. It’s as though you live within and with-out mind... Beautifully said! yes, that's what happens. I have been saying to her for years now. But I don't call it as lessons, I would like to call it as illusion that we wore unconsciously which we have been seeing through one after other. Once we see through the illusion, external changes too. |
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Post by Figgles on Feb 19, 2021 3:38:43 GMT
If that is your experience, it's your experience. As an experience, so long as it's not being mistaken for something more, something indicative of Truth beyond, there's no need to doubt it as 'an experience had.' But it is important to see that 'the future' per se, itself, is never actually experienced as all experience is here & now or not at all. Same with past. Similarly, I regularly experience continued relationship, exchanges with deceased loved ones. Many would likely say I am imagining it because it's outside of consensus trance experience. These experiences are as meaningful and compelling to me as those I had with these folks when they were alive and sitting next to me. So, while I'd balk at the suggestion I was merely 'imagining them,' I would have to concede that as experience, we are talking 'appearance only,' and not in any way indicative of Truth. (That which is known for absolute certain). Just because this current disappointment reminds you of one past, does not mean the past disappointment 'caused' this manifest outcome. (& Sorry if I am mangling what you said there). And, what feels disappointing now might turn out to be a blessing in disguise. I'm sitting smack-dab myself in circumstances surrounding my kids that had this circumstance appeared a few months ago, would have looked like a shit-pile, but at present, I am regarding, as the most perfect of circumstance. Yup! Nothing wrong with play. I would say 'disappointment' can and does still arise, but that does not = suffering. When/if disappointment does arise, absent an SVP, it does so and then just flows on....no stickiness. Mmm so do you believe that we are here to learn lessons. I feel like once I heal parts of me that were hurt or do away with old subconscious beliefs the external changes. The lessons change. This is so hard to get my head around. I ‘get’ why it’s beyond mind. I can observe a finger pressing letters on this screen right now... I can see beyond time and the I/mind which is nothing but a stream of continuous thoughts. It’s as though you live within and with-out mind... Life experience does = lessons learned, but for me, that doesn't translate into 'the reason' why we're here. When I was really into AH, I really resonated with their take that said our highest purpose...reason for being here, is for the joy of it. I liked how they emphasized enjoyment of life over the idea of learning/lessons...but really, in terms of experience, I would say the two DO pretty much go hand in hand.
The very question of purpose though, when it comes to life, (why we're here), is one of those existential questions for which there is no Truthy answer to be arrived at...it really all comes down to subjective, personal values and opinions and anyone who says they know for absolute certain what the answer to that question is, is mistaking an 'in the dream view' for Truth.
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Post by Figgles on Feb 19, 2021 3:46:51 GMT
The idea that you can know for absolute certain what will follow what in terms of the unfolding story, is a delusion. There kinds of problem will come when you don't have the reference to what I am talking. Look like you have never used any reality creation technique so I don't wonder.Pinning pics on a vision board, depicting a finished book and publishing deal isn't a 'reality creation technique'? Envisioning the desired condition as a here and now reality isn't a creation technique? Writing out desired manifestation in full detail in a journal every night before going to sleep isn't a reality creation technique?
As I described to you already in a past post, there was a time where I did all that stuff. When my desires manifested according to plan, I assure you, I regarded those techniques to be a great success. That's where I was wrong though. The techniques themselves were not actually causal to the manifestation...it just appeared that way.
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Post by Figgles on Feb 19, 2021 3:51:15 GMT
Nothing is actually being 'manipulated,' let alone by 'God.' God is a pointer only, not a something to which properties, qualities and actions can be directly ascribed as you are doing.
The bolded is just another 'in the dream theory/story/idea' that you seem to be trying to assert as Truth.
I write what I see! When there is a clarity, dream is re-orchestrated. If that's all you were saying, we'd be in agreement. You go much further though.
I agree, clarity does impact experience.....precisely 'how' though, cannot be predicted with absolute certainty.
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Post by Figgles on Feb 19, 2021 4:02:29 GMT
Mmm so do you believe that we are here to learn lessons . I feel like once I heal parts of me that were hurt or do away with old subconscious beliefs the external changes. The lessons change.This is so hard to get my head around. I ‘get’ why it’s beyond mind. I can observe a finger pressing letters on this screen right now... I can see beyond time and the I/mind which is nothing but a stream of continuous thoughts. It’s as though you live within and with-out mind... Beautifully said! yes, that's what happens. I have been saying to her for years now. But I don't call it as lessons, I would like to call it as illusion that we wore unconsciously which we have been seeing through one after other. Once we see through the illusion, external changes too.Yes, and that change is 'no suffering.'
Which really means, no more imagined SVP...no more mental overlay upon an arising, appearing condition that says, "this is intolerable...this is fundamentally wrong...this should not be appearing as it is."
That is the most significant of experiential changes...it makes all others pale in comparison. Absent the SVP and that mental overlay, all conditions become fundamentally perfect.
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Post by Esponja on Feb 19, 2021 4:06:29 GMT
Beautifully said! yes, that's what happens. I have been saying to her for years now. But I don't call it as lessons, I would like to call it as illusion that we wore unconsciously which we have been seeing through one after other. Once we see through the illusion, external changes too.Yes, and that change is 'no suffering.'
Which really means, no more imagined SVP...no more mental overlay upon an arising, appearing condition that says, "this is intolerable...this is fundamentally wrong...this should not be appearing as it is."
That is the most significant of experiential changes...it makes all others pale in comparison. Absent the SVP and that mental overlay, all conditions become fundamentally perfect.
This kind of is what singer is saying.. love it all, watch what arises, love it and let go... surrender.. |
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Post by Figgles on Feb 19, 2021 4:34:10 GMT
Yes, and that change is 'no suffering.'
Which really means, no more imagined SVP...no more mental overlay upon an arising, appearing condition that says, "this is intolerable...this is fundamentally wrong...this should not be appearing as it is."
That is the most significant of experiential changes...it makes all others pale in comparison. Absent the SVP and that mental overlay, all conditions become fundamentally perfect.
This kind of is what singer is saying.. love it all, watch what arises, love it and let go... surrender.. That message is not without value. Relative peace is no small thing. But, so long as there is an SVP, trying to love it all, trying to let go, trying to surrender, that relative relief will remain fleeting.
True surrender is an absence.... of trying to feel better....of trying to find peace....of trying to let go, trying to see the world differently than I am seeing it.
It's not impossible that in a moment of practice that is aimed at trying to augment experience, the intender/intent could fall away and become absent, but the practice itself, being for the purpose of betterment of experience, does by it's very nature, have "a person who is not satisfied with his experience," there, at it's crux.
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